An Idea to help the psionic comunity.

[spilledchemicals]

I have an Idea which may help the community learn more, at least. First, we get all of the leaders of all the psi sites to come together in a chat. We ask them to leave any grudges between conflicting viewpoints behind, with the promise that all this will be about is trying to grow the community as a whole.

We propose to create a new site, unlike any other psi site out there. It will not be run by one or two, or even a group of administrators. It will be run by every psion who is a part of the site. There will be no levels of power for any of the people apart of it. All decisions will be decided my majority polls. The majority meaning the amount who participate in that poll. (more on the polls later)

You cannot simply log onto the site and register, though. The sites which are currently out there will remain open, and will act as training grounds for new psions. After a certain amount of time of being active in a psi community, they can then request to join the new site. They do this by looking at a list of active members posted on the current site, and pm them to see if they will be accepted into it. The active member then reviews the length of time the applicant has been a member, the posts the applicant has made, and assesses whether the applicant has the necessary skills, and, most of all, the maturity to join the new site.

The site will be spilt into three separate, but equal, parts. The first will be purely governmental, meaning that is where new rules, boards, and the placement of funds will be discussed. The polls question will be put out, and open to discussion for a week before the anyone can vote. It must be made so all can see the question, so no decisions are passed which benefit only a small amount of the group. To put a new request out there, you must have a certain amount of people backing the question, as the community grows, the amount needed to start a request will grow.

The second part will be for the more conservative psions, which will deal mainly with the scientific approach to psionics. We psions in this area will try to set up experiments with measurable results. We will also try to find out how to best use psi for different results. We here must be very precise. We will create videos of our experiments, so there will be more than analogical stories. We psions here will expand the applications of psi. We will find better methods than the “just do it” method.

The third part will be for the more liberal psions. Here we will discuss the different philosophies behind psi. We here will dive into the murky waters of religion and spiritualism to find truth. We will try to discover new aspects of psi, so the second group can discover how to apply these new aspects, or new energy, or whatever we psions discover about psi.

Since this will be a draw from many different psionic communities, there will be conflicts of what people believe. But part of becoming a member of the site is maturity, so members will be able to accept that other members believe other things are true or untrue.

The word fluff will be restricted, because it is now a derogatory term in some minds. We want the community to grow, not shrink. Also, since all who join understand basic terminology, we won’t have to create fluff terms. When we do discover something new, though, we won’t need half of us turning our noses up and saying “fluff,” we need each other to push the idea further.

With the site free of inexperienced people clogging the arteries of discussion, we won't have to rehash things for new people. Major new discoveries will be turned into articles, and open to the public, encouraging new people to learn and join the site. This sets up a concrete goal for new psions, so they have something they know is real to reach for.

I wasn’t around for the golden age of psipog, but I know that time can come again. We must all join together, a house divided cannot stand! We will be the next great psions. We will be those who advance this grand field of psionics. We will be leading the path of truth. We will be Psions United.


If you like this idea, please DO NOT start trying to make it, I want suggestions which would better the idea as a whole. If you think this Idea can help psionics like I think it can, then help me share this idea, with as few edits as possible, to people who are leaders in the psi community.

For this idea to succeed we need to take the time to think this out, plan, and get enough people from other sites to support it. It won't be Psions United without psions.

[JediKaren]

I once had an idea like that. The problem is we site owners have problems with some and are best friends with others. Some owners can stand a site or just the owner or both. And no one is willing to get over their grudge.

[spilledchemicals]

If we cannot find common ground in saving the thing we care so much for, then I'm afraid this communities fate is sealed. I hope that the point where they are willing to compromise will not be too late. And is talking, just talking, no ego boosting, no squabbling, too much to ask from people who are mature? (to anyone who thinks someone else is immature, do not say so, this is about bringing people together.)

If we met under strict rules of tongue, even if it gets down to someone in the midway point passing a baton which allows people to speak, would there be no hope of hatchets being buried?

[T_Hornberger]

I fully support the idea and would do whatever is possible to help out. However, you need some ground rules. For instance, some people refer to this stuff as magic, and there is differen't things between the two, there would need to be different sections based on differen't people's viewpoints, wich apparently is the main point. I do like the idea very much. I do think it seems kind of childish if two people cannot get along however for the greatest good. This would most definately help out the psionic community, and have one big site, rather then 30 knockoff's of the same site, and only a few unique ones. If there is anything I can do, just say it. Here, Veritas, the first link has alot of members and is pretty reputable, and the link after that is a directory of sites that you might want to check first.

vsociety.net/

www.psilinks.net/

[spilledchemicals]

I like how veritas has put in three different parts for psi, chi, and magick... hmm.... We wouldn't want to split the main into too many sections... hmm.... As for ground rules, I think it would be simple. Don't dismiss anything discussed in the section it is properly in. Say we have a sub-section for other kin abilities, the rule there is to not dismiss anything pertaining to other kin, even if you don't believe in them.

The main split will keep conservatives and liberals from seeing each others views too much, so a Christian psion who only believes in the physically measurable abilities won't have to mix too much with a wiccan magick user who leaves their body on a regular basis.

The main group of people I wouldn't know how to approach would be chi based energy workers. I have studied psionics and magick well enough to approach these groups.

[JediKaren]

I don't think you all understand. Let me give you a couple examples:

psionlin is a energy manipulation site. You come and join there because that's what you are interested. They told me they won't accept any site that talks about astral projection or anything spiritual. So they don't like my site.

UPC: didn't like my site either, thought it was full of too much fluff and didn't like my articles. They even came over here and picked a fight with me, so naturally we don't get along.

Psi Links: Run by Apollo and everyone knows Apollo, but Tassadar doesn't like him after a rough rating and some trouble caused by a bit of a cruel experiment.

Astral Society: is huge, just huge, but of later all the staff got kicked off, including me, and replaced with newbies. The site is a mess and far more full of fluff than mine is.

What about the small sites, the ones like psinet, or that have 100 or two members? How do you convince the big sites like snobby UPC or PsiOnline to take them in?

Now try convincing all these site owners to ignore the history between them and magically became friends. The site politics are a mess and nearly impossible. At this time, unification isn't possible. It's a good idea, but we need different leaders. Psionics is still a new community. We're working out a lot of bugs and learning a lot about psi. We're learning a lot about teaching and about how we can or can't get along. All groups go through this. I opt for waiting and watching. But that's just me. Go ahead and do the research that I have done.

[spilledchemicals]

JediKaren, I was about to ask the state of our "leaders" relationships. I realize this is going to take a while, and that not everyone will want to join immediately, or at all, ever. I think that if we start the unition now, that when the current struggling leaders fall, as all things do, their followers will come to us.

We could look back into history to find a good way to unite the large with the small. The larger states thought little of the smaller state, and wanted to have more say the others. We offer that the larger sites, with a greater population, will naturally have more power in the polls. If we would have to, then, we would offer that the site itself would be able to have a certain extra amount of votes.

A plan of action. We first try to bring them into 3 different sides, with similar rules. Then, we try to broker a deal between the 2 larger out of the three sides. As long nothing too horrible goes wrong, the last one would willingly join, for the sake of unition.

To the people who say astral projection and OBE is fluff, we present evidence of NDE's, which should warrant sufficient evidence that there is even the smallest possibility of it being real.

Again, I say that this will take time, I've been creating this idea for 2 months now, and I wanted to see what others would think. I don't think that this site will be created for at least one to two years. If you truly don't believe that this is possible within that time frame, then I will plan for longer. But I will never give up the idea of a unified psionic community.

There is a time to watch and a time to act, and I have watched this community shrink for too long.

[JediKaren]

"To the people who say astral projection and OBE is fluff, we present evidence of NDE's, which should warrant sufficient evidence that there is even the smallest possibility of it being real."

It's not. You have to understand there are skeptics and spiritualists and in my experience the two don't get along well or more times than not, at all.

I too would like to see us unite for various reasons, but over the course of three years, I've just given it up and decided to do what I can for one site. But talk to other site leaders if you want and see what you can pull out.

[The Adfeng]

I would too. But people out there want to be the biggest and best, but that's not what psionics is about. This world is a world of "big deals", and they say that if you know more than us, you're our enemy until we learn more than you. It's just about being the top dog, the biggest forum, person, or the strongest. What we should do is counteract this with a bunch of smaller people. We could try to convince them, but I don't think they will ever listen. Everyone has their own opinion, but when the time comes to come together, let's hope that they do.

[mrnoname]

Well I really don’t post anything nowadays but I think I shall share my view about the OEC seeing as I have went from one to another on there chats and have talk to different people. There seems to be a lot of rivalry and almost a gang mentality in that they makes clams others sights are liars or full of fluff and there way is (best) or they know what there on about. I believe this comes from the set principles the sight owners and there main members have. Let me explain, people from psi world are more open to opinions of chakras and temples been real, why? Simple because this sight is probably the fist one they have found on the subjects, and because the knowledge that the owners have is more then there own at that time. Such new members look to them for advise and guidance and they tend to see what they say as true. Now this seems to form a shared belief system in the website where they believe in certain things as been true because that is what they have been told by members, mod’s, whatever. The problem comes when two group’s meet that have different view’s on the workings of psi/magic ect and if it doesn’t conform to what they think they know already. The other view is normally rejected as fluff or met with anger as it does not conform with there views. And as groups tend to share the same view point on this it leads to a gang mentality in with the websites hate each other because they don’t agree on things.

Now If people where to be more tolerant of views on psi/magic and voiced there opinion but didn’t try and claim it is true and let the person make there own mind up and generally say ok I don’t believe in that but its ok if you do, the OEC would be a better in my eyes.

Now I don’t know if this view of mine will help you or seems like the rambling of a mad man, but all I ask is that people make there own mind on beliefs from what they have experience and not to judge people on what they believe but on what they are trying to accomplish and to treat each other with respect despite differences.

Take from this what you will.

[spilledchemicals]

Thank you Mrnoname, that will help. Hmm... if there is a gang mentality, then that means the leaders won't want to give up the power they have over their followers. And your comments have been noted MBSD, We could offer to let the site leaders have the ability to have a sub-board for their site, for their big ones to post what they think about the rest of the site and the people on it. The leaders have a personal place to rant, giving them the power to influence their people, and since no one else will go there, no one would be offended.

I'll always have to hammer into my articles from now on that my way is just a possibility, and there are many other, and potentially better, ways. I don't want to have people reading my articles and thinking its the only truth, because it's not. I would never want closed mindedness to be created because of me.

[sleepyhollow94]

Although I'm rather new, I do have a couple things to say. Please don't disregard this, it's a firsthand experience. This was the first psi website I joined, and I soon began looking into others. However, as I did, quickly began noticing things that were wrong with the sites, like their layouts, their topics, etc. It was very likely because I was biased towards this site, as it was the only one I had really seen and gotten used to; the ideas and subjects and opinions it discussed were the the ones I was familiar with. This may have something to do with the dislike for and from other sites, in fact it is probably the main reason; members don't like other sites because they are different, strange, unknown. Especially newbies and members who haven't looked into other sites; they think their way is best. I am, of course, still biased as well. But I won't really bother with that right now. Anyway, the point is, people don't like what they don't know and what they're not used to. Apologies if this was terribly obvious and just silly to post.

[JediKaren]

well that does make sense. It's hard joining another site and learning how a new site works. Each site is different by working in different ways, focusing on different topics or in different ways with different non written rules. I don't want to sound like I know everything. I don't. But I do promise you have I have gone to other sites. I moded psi links, astral society, and TEL. I use to post a bit on psionline (several years ago though) I spent my first four months on psi sites on psipog. I looked through psi studies and their articles. I helped set up psi dojo. I was a moderate of universal lightworks. I know UPC due to a nasty fight I mentioned earlier. Many of these sites are run by people I personally know either by psipog's chatroom or iming with them. Some of them like me and some I like, but not all and I know some of them would rather die than join with me. It's really sad and I wish it wasn't so, but you all are right in saying we managers get into a mind set that our site is best for some reason. None of us are the best and all of us have problems. I know my site is too spiritual for some of you. I know that I have an ego. Some of you are mad at me for not giving the best help that I can give or supporting something that meant a lot to you.

[spilledchemicals]

Sleepy, your post is not silly, it is proof that we need a change. Our method, the method of all the sites I've seen, attract newcomers, who follow what they read as true, and as you have said sleepy, fear the unknown.

That is the fear which keeps us from learning, which has kept us separate. This is yet another reason why a site which has the strong opinions of so many needs to be created. These strong opinions, all coming from the same source, with radically different views, would show that there are more ways than one to learn psi.

The difference between truth and fluff are always blurry. I know it's hard to accept that some ideas out there aren't necessarily fluff, and I know it's hard to accept that someone out there thinks that what you believe is fluff.

Both of these bring anger, but that hot headedness, I hope, can be cooled. We all have to remember that, to most of the world, we are radicals, we are the ones considered wrong. We can't be each others enemies, for we have a common enemy. Ignorance is our enemy. Take everything you read with a pinch of salt, but there is always, always a grain of truth in all but lies.

People are only passionate about ideas they believe are true, and that truth means they have experienced something real. Something you may be able to experience yourself.

(They are also passionate if it gets them money, so be wary of costly sites.)

[red29216]

It sounds like a good idea to me. I just have one problem with it. One would be the direct democracy your trying to impose on the site. That would work for the first maybe 100 or so members, but if as much as 1000 people can join it could take even a month just to agree on one basic rule. Perhaps it would work first, but eventually some type of council-like government would have to be formed.

But I also agree with what many other people have said - people are not willing to unify. I don't think that means we should give up.

I think we should plan a time to talk about this in the chatroom - it's easier that way.

My advice is we first decide on a game plan - not debating whether or not it will work, but discussing how we plan on bringing people together to do this.

I think that should be the first goal. After we have everyone together, we can work on the logistics of the actually site later. But I think the first priority is to develop a plan.

BTW spilledchemicals, this is a really great thread, and that sounds like a really good idea to me. The part I like the most is the no government idea. Although I don't totally agree with it/ I don't think it will entirely work, I think it's getting to the right idea.